Pakistan's Foreign Minister Khurshid Mahmud Kasuri is someone who knows first hand the trauma caused by the continuing hostilities between India and Pakistan. A member of the National Assembly, his constituency Kasur is just a km away from the LOC. A barrister-of-law at Gray's Inn London, Kasuri comes from a family of distinguished politicians. The erudite and articulate foreign minister has always advocated better relations between the two countries. He spoke at length to Managing Editor Raj Chengappa in Islamabad as to how he sees relations proceed in days ahead. Excerpts:

Q. How would you describe relations between India and Pakistan in the light of recent developments?
A. Our relations have unfortunately been stormy and the recent changes are positive. The conversation between our prime ministers was icebreaking. We have yet another opportunity. After Lahore and Agra, as they say in English, this could be third time lucky.

Q. Do you expect any breakthroughs happening soon?
A. We would be lucky if we had something spectacular happening soon. I am a realist. Let us now look for a concerted and focused effort to improve our relations between our two countries.

Q. India has reiterated its position that Pakistan must put an end to cross-border terrorism and dismantle terrorist infrastructure across the border before resuming a dialogue?
A. I don't think it is the right approach. We are saying that we have done all we could do to stop cross border movement. I am not saying there are no people going across the border. But it is not done with the Pakistan government's connivance. If you don't believe us then let us go in for international monitoring with neutral observers maybe from the UN. Otherwise, India becomes the accuser, the prosecutor and the judge. Is this fair?

Q. India is against having international observers on our territory?
A. Another way of tackling the problem is to start talking in earnest.
Start confidence-building measures. When you start a composite dialogue you actually create a new dynamic. You unleash new forces in the interest of peace in both the countries.

Q. India insists on action from Pakistan before it agrees to talks?
A. Prime Minister Jamali has taken the initiative. It does take quite a lot of courage to pick up the phone and call given the context. This is one signal. Yes, we are willing to go the extra mile. We will not let false pride stand in the way.

Q. India insists on specific measures to end cross-border terrorism?
A. Our government is in the process of formulating a studied response. It is unfair for me to tell you exactly what, as it is collective decision of the government. We will try to do something that would lower the temperatures in the days to come. How far we succeed will depend partly on you.

Q. Is President Musharraf on board with regard to talks?
A. The present process has the complete backing of President Musharraf.

Q. And the Pakistan army?
A. Yes. And if you want to add another mirch masala the ISI also.

Q. Within a week of Prime Minister Vajpayee's offer there are over 40people dead in Kashmir?
A. It almost looks like it was synchronized to sabotage any talks. But does it make sense that one day before Prime Minister Jamali speaks to Mr Vajpayee we plan an attack in Srinagar? My fear is that there will be attacks in both countries anytime there is an effort to improve relations with India because there are lots of people who are against the process. As a starter, we should stop from the reflex action of blaming the ISI and RAW for everything that happens under the sun. It takes a lot of hard work to try improve the atmosphere. So let us not lose that opportunity.

Q. Why not get the jehadis to declare a ceasefire as a demonstration of Pakistan's sincerity?
A. We will use our clout with them. But don't run away with the conclusion that jehadis or suicide bombers take orders from the Pakistan government or its army. Yes, we have greater influence over people fighting for Kashmir - they regard Pakistan as a friend because we have always said we extend political and moral support to them. Let's start talking and Pakistan will do all it can. We will not wait. Simultaneously we can tell them that Indians have started talking and convince them to have a ceasefire.

Q. Lashkar-e-Toiba leader Hafeez Sayed has been making provocative statements saying Hindus should be killed. Why can't you take action against him?
A. We have a pluralistic society. People are as critical of establishment as you are. If I start quoting statements from the VHP or Bajrang Dal they are no less provocative than those coming from the LeT. Let me put it on record that we don't approve of Hafeez Sayed's statement. Earlier, we had him arrested and put under preventive detention. But the courts released him.

Q. Your anti-terrorist act is draconian enough to detain him?
A. There is no more draconian act than POTA. And even then you have not been able to cow down people who are opposed to government policy.

Q. Sayeed has changed his organisation's name. Why not ban the new organization he heads?
A. If there is such a case, I understand it will be done. The interior minister has said something to that effect recently about such groups. It is meaningful. The context is to improve relations with India and reduce temperatures.

Q. So how do the two countries proceed now?
A. The immediate thing we can do and that includes major politicians in India as well as those in Pakistan is try and control our rhetoric. That will help in not vitiating the atmosphere. Then both governments as a basic minimum should in a short period of time go back to were there were before the attack on Indian parliament that prompted the slide back.

Q. Like what?
A. If you allow us to send our High Commissioner I will say we will send him tomorrow.

Q. And resume your flights?
A. Yes, of course, we will resume flights if you give us the landing rights. We should make it easier for people to travel by land, air and sea routes. We should liberalize our visa regimes. We are agreeable to all reciprocal measures that will improve the atmosphere in the subcontinent.

Q. If things don't work out, could there be a war?
A. I hope not. Nothing can be ruled out. We don't want a war. We want friendship with India. Does India want a war? We are prepared for it as it would be foolish not to be.

Q. What do you think of Yashwant Sinha's statement that Pakistan was a fit case for premptive strke?
A. Let me just say I was unhappy. He is one of the few foreign ministers I haven't met. He avoided me studiously at the NAM meet in Kuala Lumpur. I would like to take this opportunity of inviting Mr Sinha to Pakistan. He would receive a warm welcome from us.